michaelcahn
Member Since : 2008
Posts(5)
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Vortex Ring State

09-14-2015 04:33:57

Have any of the RHOG members been utilizing the Vuichard method to "fly out" of the vortex ring state? Do the members know what it is and how execute it? It is Tim Tucker's prefered method to get out of the vortex ring state.

Replies

heloman
Member Since : 2015
Posts(5)
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09-14-2015 01:35:55
jabr800
Member Since : 2008
Posts(134)
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09-14-2015 07:51:28
Read the article you mentioned the other day.

I was introduced to this method last year during my annual Sutton James Insurance check ride, by the auditor who had just returned from the Robinson Safety course at that time.
I like it and I see the benefits.

As a recreational pilot, I only practice it a few times a year.

Works better for me, than the old way in my opinion.


jabr800
OlivierD
Member Since : 2014
Posts(5)
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09-16-2015 03:04:04
Sure did, that's awesome.

You just loose 20-30ft to get out of the vortex ring state instead of a 150-200ft with the conventional forward cyclic and lower collective method traditionally taught.

Just think a second about the benefit: except for training purpose at minimum 1000ft AGL, the vortex ring state occurs typically during an approach so most often close to the ground. In such situation, who would really dare to lower the collective ?
Since I've been taught the Vuichard there would be no hesitation at all: full pitch (5 min MCP), kick the power pedal (left on Robbies, of course) and swing the collective to roll in the opposite direction (right of course). And you're out of it before you even thought you would be. That's impressive.

It's a safe and quite an easy manoeuvre which doesn't take long to get used to.

Thumbs up for Claude Vuichard !
melvynheli
Member Since : 2007
Posts(105)
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09-17-2015 10:14:38
Should be "swing the cyclic?"
OlivierD
Member Since : 2014
Posts(5)
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09-28-2015 02:50:33
Sure, of course :-)
Jok234
Member Since : 2015
Posts(1)
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11-16-2018 02:29:25

Hi, I fly the R44 as FI and we tried this exercise may be once every 90 days. At 1500 ft Agl, hold ac steady and reduced forward speed to minimum ( close to zero speed) and maintain Map at 14” down wind. Too bad never experienced the SWP. We just feel the Ac vibrates and loss altitude 100 ft or so....Question how to get it perfectly? I want to see the Ac settling as real as possible....thanks Jok

William
Member Since : 2017
Posts(3)
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11-18-2018 04:05:57

Hey Jok,

I am just wrapping up my CFI & CFII.  We have been utilizing the Vuichard method now for about a year and now its the only way our school teaches our students.  So the way we get set up for SWP/VRS as follows

  1. Establish aircraft over safe area we typically start at 3000-4500 MSL our airport is 1427'
  2. Gauge Check
  3. Clearing turns - around, above, & below
  4. Turn into a tailwind
  5. Decrease power with collective (50-60% applied)
  6. Aft cyclic to Hover atitude we typically want to get below ETL so slowly reduce airspeed to below 30kts IAS
  7. Recover on the onset of SWP/VRS
    1. You will have increased vibrations & shutters
    2. Trim stings will go limb as an one indicator
    3. Sloppy controls due to SWP/VRS and sinking rate begins
    4. Adding power only futher increases rate of decent >500ft per min

Now to recover with the Vuichard Method as follows:

  1. Raise collective to MCP
  2. Apply Lateral Cyclic in the direction of tail rotor thrust (Robinson products will be right cyclic)
  3. Maintain heading with pedals
  4. Maintain rotor RPM

At this point the decent will be arrested do as follows

  1. Lateral cyclic to level aircraft
  2. Forward cyclic to regain airspeed

 

Recovery will be if done properly I have seen 10-40ft which is signifcantly better than 500 plus with the traditional way.  

Keep in mind if you are teaching or practicing settling with power be sure you are following what is required in the PTS so recovery must be within 1000ft AGL and to remain safe yourself.  Any other questions let me know.  Also, check this link out below and keep in mind when you watch this video it is in a clockwise rotating helicopter so its oposite from what we do in a Robinson.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HjeRSDsy-nE

Hope this helps!

William

Chuck
Member Since : 2018
Posts(1)
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11-28-2018 03:06:08

Where could I find the article that was talked about above?  Im new to the site and not a pilot yet.  I have heard about Vortix Ring State and would like to learn more about it.  Has anyone experienced it in real life other than training?  At what point is it most able to occur at? Thx in advanced.

Robi Newbie